bitter topic

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bitter topic

Post  mollyr on Sun Apr 26, 2009 11:25 am

I hope this doesn't offened anyone but I have been debating it for quite some time.
I have read a pretty good debate on the PETA web site but I still can't figure out whether it is good or bad.
What do you think about horse slaughter?

I say it is a horrible thing the way the animals are treated through the process but I also think that if there wasn't a way to control the horse population then there would be thousands of starving, neglected horses.
There are other things in my mind but I would like to here what you have to say...
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Re: bitter topic

Post  Gallamist on Sun Apr 26, 2009 12:12 pm

I dont necessiraly like horse slaughter but, think it's a necessary evil right now.

There are so many horses out there and not enough people/money to keep and care for them. They end up in the auction and generally a good portion go to the meat man. He doesn't take everything he buys to the plant tho.

If they had better laws on how these horses are to be transported and euthanized once at the plant I think it would be much better....the captive bolt doesn't always kill them on the first shot. I seen a video online a few yrs ago with a horse at the slaughter plant being hit 21 times (i counted) with the captive bolt....not only in the head either...Wasn't pretty.

I'm not against it, I'm not for it either, I wouldn't ever send a horse to the auction as I would not want to take the risk of it ending up at the plant.

But, I would rather see a horse go to slaughter then see a horse starve to death out in a pasture or be neglected/abused and die that way.

I am not a supporter of PETA never have been, never will...they are just as evil as anyone else...there crazy!...I won't go furter into my thoughts of them for the sake of a debate about PETA. Wink
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Re: bitter topic

Post  mollyr on Sun Apr 26, 2009 1:04 pm

I don't supprt PETA either, I was just reading what they had to say about this topic tongue
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Re: bitter topic

Post  DressageAndRhinestones on Sun Apr 26, 2009 10:36 pm

As long as there are people breeding useless horses, there will be horse slaughter. When you breed your mare because "baby horses are cute!" then you are essentially feeding your dog(s). Every horse bred needs to have a purpose in mind, then it needs to be properly raised and trained for that purpose. The problem is that this takes time money and effort, something that a lot of people lack these days.
The only foreseeable way I can think of to reduce horse slaughter is to require every breed able horse to belong to a studbook (registry) and if it cant be accepted into any by law it needs to be sterilized. Then introduce a program where all breedings must be approved. This is how many of the worlds finest breeds have remained so for tens or hundreds of years, and these are all horses you never see being sold for meat price.
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Re: bitter topic

Post  Gallamist on Mon Apr 27, 2009 8:29 am

Unless a horse has a soundness issue that is not 'fixable', mental issue or some sort of other physical issue where it can't be ridden. I don't think any horse is useless....It's people that label a horse 'useless' when they don't have the time or money to dedicate to a horses training and learning. They don't do nothing with a horse from the time it's born to the time it's a 2yr old or so and then they wonder why they can't do diddly squat with it, then it ends up at the auction.
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Re: bitter topic

Post  JezzaBella on Mon Apr 27, 2009 5:57 pm

It's a really grey area, so I do agree with you mollyr.

The states banned slaughter, so all these horses are being shipped to countries that do slaughter... many under horrid conditions even elongating their stress and pain.

It's a real top topic for discussion/argument, because it's such a grey area and so many are very passionate. I see both sides and understand both arguments. I know you`ll never see one of my horses at an auction, as long as I`m alive and past that.
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Re: bitter topic

Post  JezzaBella on Mon Apr 27, 2009 6:03 pm

DressageAndRhinestones wrote:As long as there are people breeding useless horses, there will be horse slaughter. When you breed your mare because "baby horses are cute!" then you are essentially feeding your dog(s). Every horse bred needs to have a purpose in mind, then it needs to be properly raised and trained for that purpose. The problem is that this takes time money and effort, something that a lot of people lack these days.
The only foreseeable way I can think of to reduce horse slaughter is to require every breed able horse to belong to a studbook (registry) and if it cant be accepted into any by law it needs to be sterilized. Then introduce a program where all breedings must be approved. This is how many of the worlds finest breeds have remained so for tens or hundreds of years, and these are all horses you never see being sold for meat price.

I agree with you on some points, although less drastic. I love a lot of mixed bred horses, such as a Percheron arab mix a friend of mine had. As well as my clyde mix. Not just purebred horses are worth something to the majority of horse lovers and owners. If I want to breed and raise my own horse from my own mare and she`s not papered, I sure as heck am going to regardless.

But I agree with your gripe of uneducated owners just wanting their mare to have a baby, because they love her and think she`s awesome and would love a cute baby to bond with. Regardless of the mares breeding qualities (I don`t see registration as being absolutely necessary for that, but I know that`s not the norm opinion in the `horse world`)
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Re: bitter topic

Post  KiddingAround on Tue Apr 28, 2009 10:59 am

I was at the auction in Innisfail and quite a few horses ended up going to the meat buyer. I did notice that the auctioneer would get him to start the bidding on some horses, and that gave people incentive to bid on them and take them home. He also has a price limit, and if it looks like the horse is bringing a decent dollar, he will quit bidding and let someone else take them home.

Back on the topic though, I think it is a necessary evil. There are too many horses in sad neglect, or living at homes without the money or knowledge to care for them. I am not for it, and it breaks my heart to go to an auction and see so many horses go, but you can't save them all. My own horses will not go to auction, but that is because I do not live beyond my means. I know how many animals I can care for. Maybe one day people will realize that babies are not just "cute" and city people will not buy a one acre place and think that they "need" a pony for their kids and have no clue about horses.
One day.................
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Re: bitter topic

Post  Gypsy_Vanner on Tue Apr 28, 2009 11:49 am

I think it's a necessary evil as well. With all the people who feel it unnecessary to geld their studs and allow them to keep breeding, they are the problem.

Going to the auctions, you generally don't see the trained horse's go to slaughter it's the herd of 20 the Joe Blow brought in. They've been living in his back 40 with no handling on them, the have at least 2 studs out as well not including the baby studs that are know breeding. They are the problem.

If you want to breed your horse fine but as a responsible horse owner you better have a plan for that baby. Training when the time comes. Handling from birth, etc.

At this point if we banned slaughter in Canada I think we'd be in a similair situation as the States as we'd be seeing alot more thin and dying horses with no where to go. Slaughter may be nasty but it helps those with little money to be able to thin their herds down and keep the population down.
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Re: bitter topic

Post  JezzaBella on Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:25 pm

Gypsy_Vanner wrote:I think it's a necessary evil as well. With all the people who feel it unnecessary to geld their studs and allow them to keep breeding, they are the problem.

Going to the auctions, you generally don't see the trained horse's go to slaughter it's the herd of 20 the Joe Blow brought in. They've been living in his back 40 with no handling on them, the have at least 2 studs out as well not including the baby studs that are know breeding. They are the problem.

If you want to breed your horse fine but as a responsible horse owner you better have a plan for that baby. Training when the time comes. Handling from birth, etc.

At this point if we banned slaughter in Canada I think we'd be in a similair situation as the States as we'd be seeing alot more thin and dying horses with no where to go. Slaughter may be nasty but it helps those with little money to be able to thin their herds down and keep the population down.

I agree with everything you said :-)
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Re: bitter topic

Post  buckskinchic on Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:10 pm

I am ANTI- PETA. They normally argue their point with out one stitch of research onto the other sides view. I am for horse slaughter, sure I am a horse lover but I would rather see a horse go to slaughter then be abandoned with no food nor water in its stall or sit in a pasture with ski's on its hooves and foundered.

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Re: bitter topic

Post  Gallamist on Tue Apr 28, 2009 8:51 pm

Just a lil something for those who are supporters of PETA.....something to think about.

April 15, 2009


Exclusive: PETA’s Pet Killing Program Set a New Record in 2008
Public Records: PETA Found Adoptive Homes for Less than 1 out of 300 Animals

Animal lovers worldwide now have access to more than a decade’s worth of proof that People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA) kills thousands of defenseless pets at its Norfolk, Virginia headquarters. Since 1998, PETA has opted to “put down” 21,339 adoptable dogs, cats, puppies, and kittens instead of finding homes for them.

PETA’s “Animal Record” report for 2008, filed with the Virginia Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services, shows that the animal rights group killed 95 percent of the dogs and cats in its care last year. During all of 2008, PETA found adoptive homes for just seven pets.

Just seven animals -- out of the 2,216 it took in. PETA just broke its own record.

Why would an animal rights group secretly kill animals at its headquarters? PETA’s continued silence on the matter makes it hard to say for sure. But from a cost-saving standpoint, PETA’s hypocrisy isn’t difficult to understand: Killing adoptable cats and dogs – and storing the bodies in a walk-in freezer until they can be cremated – requires far less money and effort than caring for the pets until they are adopted.

PETA has a $32 million annual budget. But instead of investing in the lives of the thousands of flesh and blood creatures in its care, the group spends millions on media campaigns telling Americans that eating meat, drinking milk, fishing, hunting, wearing leather shoes, and benefiting from medical research performed on lab rats are all “unethical.”

The bottom line: PETA’s leaders care more about cutting into their advertising budget than finding homes for the nearly six pets they kill on average, every single day.

The Virginia Beach SPCA, just down the road from PETA’s Norfolk headquarters, manages to adopt out the vast majority of the animals in its care. And it does it on a shoestring budget.

Years of public outrage has not been enough to convince PETA to eliminate its pet eradication program.

Now the death toll of animals in PETA’s care has reached 21,339, including more than 2,000 pets last year. That’s not an animal charity. It’s a slaughterhouse

Still want to support PETA?
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Re: bitter topic

Post  Gypsy_Vanner on Wed Apr 29, 2009 10:37 am

Doesn't really surprise me as there main lady doesn't believe in humans having pets. It's cruel.
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